Forum Groups

 

Forums / Talking Turf / Which came first the chicken or the nematode?

Which came first the chicken or the nematode?

10 posts
  1. Joshua Gehman
    Joshua Gehman avatar
    1 posts
    11/13/2013 7:11 AM
    During the course of this past July, I lost a lot of grass on my greens for the first time. Nice experience. It seems the culprit was nematodes. Two applications of Avid seemed to do the trick However... The label of
    Avid clearly says to tank mix in a fungicide to be watered in with it. The targeted fungus is pythium.

    I had two salesmen tell me that, in our area, nematodes are not the primary problem, root pythium is. They stated that when the roots become weakened by the fungus, THEN the nematodes go crazy.

    After the first application of Avid we saw a stop in the loss of grass, except on my 8th green. That one looked like I skipped it. So, I put down some left over Nemacure (with out any fungicide) that we had and that green rebounded the nicest of all of them.

    From my experience, I believe the nematodes are the primary problem. The pythium then takes advantage of the damaged roots via the feeding holes produced by the nematodes. What do you think?



  2. Smith Kerry L
    Smith Kerry L avatar
    11/13/2013 8:11 AM
    I would absolutely agree with your conclusion. Injury/stress equal disease.



  3. Andy Jorgensen
    Andy Jorgensen avatar
    1 posts
    11/13/2013 8:11 AM
    Joshua Gehman said: During the course of this past July, I lost a lot of grass on my greens for the first time. Nice experience. It seems the culprit was nematodes. Two applications of Avid seemed to do the trick However... The label of
    Avid clearly says to tank mix in a fungicide to be watered in with it. The targeted fungus is pythium.

    I had two salesmen tell me that, in our area, nematodes are not the primary problem, root pythium is. They stated that when the roots become weakened by the fungus, THEN the nematodes go crazy.

    After the first application of Avid we saw a stop in the loss of grass, except on my 8th green. That one looked like I skipped it. So, I put down some left over Nemacure (with out any fungicide) that we had and that green rebounded the nicest of all of them.

    From my experience, I believe the nematodes are the primary problem. The pythium then takes advantage of the damaged roots via the feeding holes produced by the nematodes. What do you think?


    First question: have you sent off an assay to determine your Nematode counts?

    Florida now has the new 24C labeling for Avid requiring the application of Heritage with it. This is based on the findings that Dr. Billy Crow did at the University of Florida. The applications that had the Heritage with it had the best results. Hence the new label. Makes good sense, really.

    And I would tend to agree that the pythium entered AFTER the Nematode caused damage. Pythium is always often present in the soil, but needs a susceptible host to become active. The host plant being damaged by Nematode feeding causes the susceptibility. As does the right weather, cultural stresses, mechanical damage, etc...

    I have also heard of suggested applications of Interface after a Nortica application. Same theory.

    I'd say applying both would cover all bases. Similar to our area with Bermudagrass Decline. Although the Gaeumannomyces graminis var. graminis may be the initial culprit, Pythium spp. is often the major damaging factor after the fact. Applying a fungicide for one without controlling the other does no good.



  4. Steven Huffstutler
    Steven Huffstutler avatar
    11 posts
    11/13/2013 12:11 PM
    Im reading the label and I dont see any requirement for using Heritage with it. It does suggest using Heritage, but it doesn't require it.



  5. Andy Jorgensen
    Andy Jorgensen avatar
    1 posts
    11/13/2013 3:11 PM
    Steven Huffstutler, CGCS said: Im reading the label and I dont see any requirement for using Heritage with it. It does suggest using Heritage, but it doesn't require it.


    You are correct. First time I've actually seen the label. Recommended....

    Would still be a good practice. Dr. Crow had good data and results when applied together.

    Here is the 24C label for Florida.

    http://www.syngentacropprotection.com/pdf/special/fl0896066aa1013.pdf



  6. Steven Huffstutler
    Steven Huffstutler avatar
    11 posts
    11/13/2013 6:11 PM
    I've still got 800 lbs of Nemacur, but it's nice to finally have an alternative.



  7. David Stout
    David Stout avatar
    0 posts
    11/13/2013 9:11 PM
    I too have have had high nematode counts and have experienced bermuda decline (severe) even though most would say our desert environment would not be one likely to host this particular pathogen. While nematodes can strike anywhere, I've come to the conclusion that in most circumstances they seem to go hand in hand. I would strongly recommend doing an assy as a previous poster suggests and manage the best way you can without using nemacure unless it is an absolute last resort. We've managed through both using briskway, day action, many others, venting every 7-10 days (.20" tines) proper mowing heights, and using sound agronomic practices as the backbone to every day we arrive on the course.

    While by no means do I feel comfortable, I do feel on paper we have covered bases and are prepared to head into winter as best as possible. Believe me, as someone who was a fervent supporter of bent to bermuda conversion; this was unexpected and was both scary and dangerous, but seem to be manageable.....at least at this stage.



  8. Thomas Brown
    Thomas Brown avatar
    0 posts
    11/14/2013 1:11 PM
    Joshua, where are you located?



  9. Curtis Nickerson
    Curtis Nickerson avatar
    0 posts
    11/15/2013 5:11 AM
    I understand that during the trials at UF they had good success with the Avid at 12oz/acre, but obviously greater control at the higher rates. My hope is the drop the ridiculous heritage/avid combo. @$2500 a "pack" on 14-21 day intervals it's a pricy solution, However having said that I am happy to have it at my disposal.



  10. Joshua Gehman
    Joshua Gehman avatar
    1 posts
    11/15/2013 6:11 AM
    Thomas Brown, CGCS said: Joshua, where are you located?

    South east Pa.



View or change your forums profile here.