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1. Jeffrey Parker

   

   0 posts
   
   11/9/2011 1:11 PM

   I was hoping those of you that use Embark for Poa Annua seedhead suppresion can help me. I have used Proxy/Primo for the last 9 years, but was thinking about changing to Embark. I sprayed Proxy/Primo three times last year three weeks apart with the first spray on March 18th of this year. I got good seedhead suppression, but I started to see a lot of scalping on greens in May and June. I think it could be because of the third Proxy/Primo app. Anyways, just wanted to get ideas from people that use Embark. I am in central Ohio, greens are push up soil based with lots of Poa. I am also thinking about spraying tees and fairways with Embark. Please give me your thoughts, pros and cons of switching.
   
   Thanks,
   
   Jeff Parker
   The Links at Groveport
   jparker@groveport.org

   
   
   
   
2. Wydra David A

   
   11/10/2011 10:11 AM

   We went from the Primo/Proxy combo and tried the Embark T&O on our A4 Bent greens for seedhead suppression. A .75oz/1000 was applied in the beginning of May in 2gal h20/1000. About 5 days later we bagan to notice some tip burn, and by 10 days we were wondering if we hadn't just killed our new bent grass greens. We couldn't figure out why. We checked over every detail of the application from rates to weather conditions. Within three weeks, we had them back, but not without a massive amount of stress! All this leads to my point (and lesson learned) - If it isn't broken, don't fix it. Are you dissatisfied with your Primo/Proxy results? You've been using them for nine years so they must have been doing the job. If you simply must try it, do a test plot somewhere first (which we had done and had good results). Hope this helps.
   
   Dave Wydra
   Awbrey Glen Golf Club
   Bend, OR

   
   
   
   
3. Matthew Turner_2

   

   0 posts
   
   11/10/2011 2:11 PM

   I have been using Primo and Proxy for 4 years and I always have an excellent result with poa seedhead supression (90 to 100% control) compared to Embark (at best maybe 60 to 70% control). However, I have been fighting scalping issues during the summer months when I use Primo and Proxy. The nice thing about using Primo and Proxy (3 applications at 14 days apart in March thru April) is that I don't have to "guess" when to spray for seedhead control. The greens here at Conestoga is about 80 to 100% poa.
   
   This year I have discovered that at high rate of Primo was actually shrinking the poa roots while the bent was going deeper. This happened during the best growing period for poa (March to May) and I was very puzzled by this. By Memorial Day, the poa roots were only about one inch deep and I had no choice but to stop using Primo for the summer months. Shortly after the greens got out of regulation, the poa roots were going deeper again. HOWEVER, once I stopped the Primo in May, the scalping issues was thru the roof. It was a daily battle all summer long and I was trying everything to minimize the scalping issues such as topdressing, verticutting, vertigrooming, rolling first before mow and etc. It gets worse if you have been using Proxy and then stop Primo later in the season. After Labor day, I started to use Primo (light rate) again and the scalping issue suddenly disappeared. We have one green that had been resodded about 3 years ago that is about 95% bentgrass and this year I decided not to use proxy on that particular green since there wasn't much poa to begin with. On that green, I did not have any scalping issue all year long. That's how I knew about the proxy "side effect".
   
   Having said that, next year I will be using Embark for seedhead control instead of Primo and Proxy. I would much rather deal with some poa seedheads (2 to 3 weeks) than lost of poa roots during spring. Hope this helps.
   
   Matthew Turner
   Conestoga Country Club
   Lancaster, PA

   
   
   
   
4. John Hansgen

   

   0 posts
   
   11/11/2011 9:11 AM

   embark definately has a yellowing of the turf. Iron added helps some. I only do it on the fairways(rye,blue mix). Yet to try it on greens. Primo Proxy, greens (poa/penncross) throughout poa seeding season and cut the proxy out and go primo other than around aerating events, when we eliminate all tgr's. Has worked good for us. We mix it up with granular and foliar apps. Doesn't the embark label say no to bentgrass greens.

   
   
   
   
5. Robert Steger

   

   0 posts
   
   11/12/2011 8:11 AM

   I used Embark for the first time last year on my 80% poa greens. I had not been getting real good control with Primo/Proxy. I think my success with Primo/Proxy was limited due to the fact that I have different types of greens constructed on this golf course, with a mixture of push up/USGA greens, I think that some of the greens warmed up a little quicker and I may have missed the window some years, or sprayed too early in other years (even though the GDD tracker had me in the window). This is my theory anyways.
   
   Embark worked great and it saves a bunch of money. I mixed the Embark with Civitas, which did an excellent job at controlling the "yellowing" that most people see when they spray Embark. A local Superintendent (who has been using Embark on his greens for years) gave me 2 pieces of advise that I think are really important if you are going to try Embark.
   1) Make sure your greens are covered for disease, you will shut them down, and you don't want a disease you can't grow out of.
   2) Keep the Embark off your rough, you won't kill it, but it will look bad for 4-6 weeks if you spray it. I sprayed the greens and had my Assistant follow me around with the watering truck washing any Embark off the intermediate, immediately after the application.
   
   The use of Civitas with Embark had a duel effect in my opinion, it stopped the yellowing, and gave me a real good spray indicator, allowing me to make a perfect application, with no doubts if I had a miss or overlap. I have also heard that PAR or one of the other pigment products may do the same thing as Civitas.
   
   Instead of making 2 apps of Primo/Proxy, we were able to control 90% of seedhead production with 1 app of Embark.

   
   
   
   
6. Kyle Marshall

   

   2 posts
   
   11/13/2011 9:11 AM

   rsteger59 said: I used Embark for the first time last year on my 80% poa greens. I had not been getting real good control with Primo/Proxy. I think my success with Primo/Proxy was limited due to the fact that I have different types of greens constructed on this golf course, with a mixture of push up/USGA greens, I think that some of the greens warmed up a little quicker and I may have missed the window some years, or sprayed too early in other years (even though the GDD tracker had me in the window). This is my theory anyways.
   
   Embark worked great and it saves a bunch of money. I mixed the Embark with Civitas, which did an excellent job at controlling the "yellowing" that most people see when they spray Embark. A local Superintendent (who has been using Embark on his greens for years) gave me 2 pieces of advise that I think are really important if you are going to try Embark.
   1) Make sure your greens are covered for disease, you will shut them down, and you don't want a disease you can't grow out of.
   2) Keep the Embark off your rough, you won't kill it, but it will look bad for 4-6 weeks if you spray it. I sprayed the greens and had my Assistant follow me around with the watering truck washing any Embark off the intermediate, immediately after the application.
   
   The use of Civitas with Embark had a duel effect in my opinion, it stopped the yellowing, and gave me a real good spray indicator, allowing me to make a perfect application, with no doubts if I had a miss or overlap. I have also heard that PAR or one of the other pigment products may do the same thing as Civitas.
   
   Instead of making 2 apps of Primo/Proxy, we were able to control 90% of seedhead production with 1 app of Embark.

   
   
   What rates are you using for civitas/embark
   
   Thanks
   
   Kyle Marshall

   
   
   
   
7. Robert Steger

   

   0 posts
   
   11/13/2011 9:11 AM

   I applied Embark T and O (30 oz./acre) + Primo (0.1 oz./M) + Civitas (8 oz./M) on Friday April 29th. Make sure you are using the correct from of Embark, the 2-S is 10x more concentrated (it would be really bad to spray this at 30oz./acre). I forgot that I added the Primo into the mix as well. I think I was a little chicken on the Embark rate, but I didn't want to go too crazy on my first try, really happy with the results at the lower rate. Hope this helps.