Drinking Water Fountains on course Cancel The title field is required!

1. Greg Cormier

   

   0 posts
   
   7/3/2013 5:07 AM

   Does anyone have experience running potable water and power around the golf course to supply permenent drinking fountains with chiller units? I am looking for rough numbers to present the option to our members.
   
   If you have done this could you tell me how many you installed, the cost of the project, and what the golfers think of it?
   
   Thank you.

   
   
   
   
2. James Smith

   

   112 posts
   
   7/3/2013 6:07 AM

   Sorry I have not done this before but what I have done is take out the drinking fountains and replace them with water coolers.
   
   Our chiller water coolers were always an issue with vandalism and wasp love to make nest in them. When ours were being vandalized or just broke down we elected not to replace them was all.
   
   If you have irrigation satellite controllers on your course you already have a source of electricity to draw from so the closer to a box you can get them the easier it would be to get your power. running a good potable water line would be the trick though since most golf courses only have good water around bathrooms, clubhouse or maintenance areas. Even though we have a good water source and power around our bathrooms we still elect not to place the electric coolers in or around them. Our course is in the middle of a subdivision and having a drinking source seems to draw outsiders that say they are just passing through. We have purposely pulled coolers out, away from our outer boundaries since we have seen groups of these passer through congregate around these coolers running them dry or even pulling them out and sticking their hands in them (we now have pad locks on them).
   
   Our clubhouse is located in the middle of our property which is one big rectangle and our members can access the club from 6 different locations so if they truly need something, they only have to pause their game to get it. The coolers we now have left are mainly for the walkers but are centered on the course's interior to keep the unwanteds out of the course.
   
   unless you are a high end course I question the need for chilled water anyway. yes it is good to drink on a hot day but you miss out on sales if you offer cold beverages for free on the course. Maybe a simple water fountain would be better. they make several really good fountains that blend into the landscape (look like large rocks) and I have personally drank from a few of the hot fountains and had no problem with it.
   
   With the chillers you need to remember to service them and shut them down during freezes and unless you have a good cleaning program it will not take long for them to start looking poorly.

   
   
   
   
3. Sean Hoolehan

   

   0 posts
   
   7/3/2013 9:07 AM

   Greg,
   
   I did this a few years ago. I was fortunate to have a potable water main running through the property. We tapped the main in close proximity to a good location (preferably a place golfers pass twice a nine). I actually called a couple plumbing contractors in my area explained what I wanted to do and they helped get the permits I need for the toilet renovation. I would have probably had to had a permit to add the public fountain or at least a inspection. If you do not have the water main close by you could have a potable water line plowed in.
   
   Good luck.

   
   
   
   
4. Andy Jorgensen

   

   1 posts
   
   7/3/2013 7:07 PM

   I use this calculator to help me determine what size pipe I need for long runs like that. You can play with it to see if you can run a smaller(cheaper) sized pipe for a longer distance before upping it at the source. Then, once you know your pipe requirements, call your pipe source and get a price.
   
   I am about to run a line 2,600' to a new bathroom under construction. The calculator told me I could run 1.5" poly vinyl potable supply line the entire distance with no more than a 3 psi drop. I ordered the pipe in 300' rolls and therefore will only have 10 couplers the entire run. I wanted 1,000ft rolls but worried about handling them. If I were going to run PVC, it would require a 2" supply downsized to 3/4" by the time it got to the bathroom.
   
   Your most expensive aspect with this project will by trenching and wire. Electricians don't like to dig, and I have been quoted as high as $10/ft when they do it. If you can do part or most of the work yourself, you'd save alo of money. I would discourage pulling from your irrigation controller. Typically a controller pulls 3 amps. Five a side and you have a full breaker with no room for drawdown.
   
   http://www.pressure-drop.com/online-calculator

   
   
   
   
5. Greg Cormier

   

   0 posts
   
   7/7/2013 6:07 AM

   Thanks everyone for the advice. Much appreciated.

   
   
   
   
6. Corey Eastwood

   

   80 posts
   
   7/8/2013 12:07 PM

   Every irrigation designer I have talked to said not to tap off controller power to run drinking fountains or any thing else that is ongoing.

   
   Corey Eastwood CGCS, Stockton Golf & CC, Retired
   
   
7. Keith Pegg

   

   0 posts
   
   7/8/2013 5:07 PM

   Corey Eastwood, CGCS said: Every irrigation designer I have talked to said not to tap off controller power to run drinking fountains or any thing else that is ongoing.

   
   
   Why?
   I run a number of small things off the wiring that goes to my clocks RB system even a 1hp fountain in one lake. I do not run it off the clock themselves but the power lines that feed all the clocks. I had a electrician check it all out and no problems. I have been on 10 or more courses around the world and have always used the wire feeds (within the load limits). Never saw any problems; I have even run power drill with alligator clips inside the clocks that was before the cordless drills of course. An irrigation designer is not an electrician but you need to check with a good and trusted electrician of course.
   
   Keith
   Japan

   
   
   
   
8. Keith Pegg

   

   0 posts
   
   7/8/2013 5:07 PM

   Water on the course,
   
   Sell it in the proshop, the health of outdoor water is a nightmare. make a profit and sell it.
   
   Keith
   Zama Japan

   
   
   
   
9. Andy Jorgensen

   

   1 posts
   
   7/8/2013 8:07 PM

   Keith Pegg said:

   Corey Eastwood, CGCS said: Every irrigation designer I have talked to said not to tap off controller power to run drinking fountains or any thing else that is ongoing.

   
   
   Why?
   I run a number of small things off the wiring that goes to my clocks RB system even a 1hp fountain in one lake. I do not run it off the clock themselves but the power lines that feed all the clocks. I had a electrician check it all out and no problems. I have been on 10 or more courses around the world and have always used the wire feeds (within the load limits). Never saw any problems; I have even run power drill with alligator clips inside the clocks that was before the cordless drills of course. An irrigation designer is not an electrician but you need to check with a good and trusted electrician of course.
   
   Keith
   Japan

   
   
   
   Keith,
   
   If your breaker has enough juice, no problem. But I know most electricians don't size over 15 or 20 amps per circuit. Since most courses average 5 satellites per side @ 3 amps each, that's 15 amps without leaving much room for drawdown due to the long runs. Upping your breaker will give you more room as long as the panel itself can handle it.
   
   Another thought is running something off the line that has more draw than what the wire is sized for. For instance, running your 1hp motor on a 12/3 direct burial probably isn't good in the long run. The wire would prematurely fail and short out unknowingly.
   
   I was at a course once where they spliced into the irrigation power to run a bathroom. It was fine except for first thing in the morning when the crew would turn the inside lights on to, you know, "take a break" and the water fountain would kick on. All that coupled together would trip the breaker. It took me forever to figure out why until the irrigation tech filled me in. After that we made sure you either took your break in the dark or you did it at the shop. Would rarely happen during the day since the bathroom had enough light in it you didn't need to turn on the lights.

   
   
   
   
10. Keith Pegg

    

    0 posts
    
    7/9/2013 5:07 PM

    Never had a problem BUT I have always had it checked out frist. And even wired by the same so that if I would have he can fix.
    
    That was an interesting problem
    
    Keith
    Zama Japan