Decline in bentgrass putting greens? Cancel The title field is required!

1. Charles Lafferty

   

   0 posts
   
   6/4/2015 1:06 PM

   Seeing severe decline in our older varieties of bent grass on our greens. Started in early May following a few applications, don't want to point to any chemical yet, but have a good idea which one is causing the problem. Been in contact with other course in our area experiencing similar problems, just curious if anyone else is seeing this? Thanks

   
   
   
   
2. Clay Putnam

   

   33 posts
   
   6/4/2015 4:06 PM

   Charles,
   
   I can understand your reluctance to indict the manufacturer, but can you give details of the apps (including the chemical) and the symptoms of the bent grass? This could be vital information to those who may be using a similar program. It would be a shame for some to be "in jeopardy" while others have this info and not share.
   
   Nothing wrong or accusing by describing your app(s) and subsequent turf conditions.
   
   My $0.02...

   
   
   
   
3. Charles Lafferty

   

   0 posts
   
   6/4/2015 9:06 PM

   Generic signature seems to be the issue, made in China, several more I's to dot and T's to cross, but all signs lead to these apps. Don't want to go any further. Hope this does help a few others and hopefully we can all work together and figure this thing out. If not comfortable on this forum contact me at 914-760-3331!

   
   
   
   
4. Charles Lafferty

   

   0 posts
   
   6/4/2015 9:06 PM

   The symptoms appeared in early may after two apps of above product and I wrote it off to primo proxy injury on old bents, kinda stunted and off color, kinda purple and modeled. Sent out several samples for any kind of disease or nematode and all came back clean, but the decline and poor color and growth continued, stop product use after eliminating all other factors, but once the warmer weather came, they just went south fast and all my rye grass in my collars and approaches just flat out died in a clear spray pattern at the end of the passes. Craziest thing and most frustrating thing I have ever scene or dealt with and the company just denies any problems.

   
   
   
   
5. Clay Putnam

   

   33 posts
   
   6/5/2015 7:06 AM

   Thanks for sharing, Charles. Hope you get a speedy recovery on your greens.

   
   
   
   
6. Hartman Jesse

   
   6/5/2015 2:06 PM

   ...........

   
   
   
   
7. Charles Lafferty

   

   0 posts
   
   6/5/2015 4:06 PM

   Yes 4.6 oz/m

   
   
   
   
8. Jeremy Adkins

   

   0 posts
   
   6/5/2015 9:06 PM

   Just heard about a possible recall on Alt 70. Good luck.

   
   
   
   
9. Charles Lafferty

   

   0 posts
   
   6/6/2015 4:06 AM

   Yes its been rather crazy and definitely article worthy, its not over yet but its coming and turf is sowing signs of life. Thanks for the support

   
   
   
   
10. Larry Stowell

    

    0 posts
    
    6/7/2015 11:06 AM

    Posted by John Kaminski on Turfdiseases.org
    http://www.turfdiseases.org/turfdisewp/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/UTA-Letter-RE-ALT-70-Stop-Sale-06-05-15.pdf

    
    
    
    
11. David Gresham

    

    0 posts
    
    6/10/2015 9:06 AM

    Same here Charles..... Got a ArmorTech factory rep coming tomo.to look and discuss my application. All 20 greens affected in widespread streaks.

    
    
    
    
12. Charles Lafferty

    

    0 posts
    
    6/11/2015 6:06 AM

    Sorry to hear that, another area super and I tried to warn them, but they just denied a problem and you were another victim we were trying to avoid. Watch what you say to this guy, might come down to the lawyers with their current stance, but I am confident it was nothing any of did and a rare case of product contamination. Good luck. thanks for posting Chip

    
    
    
    
13. Charles Lafferty

    

    0 posts
    
    6/18/2015 10:06 AM

    They found it and it makes allot of sense now, appears it was cross contaminated with a road side herbicide, Oust. and Ouch this shouldn't be anywhere near your golf course let alone your greens and approaches. I hope the fact that the manufacture came clean with the problem indicates they are backing their product and not leaving us poor saps holding the bag for a mistake that was made in the production of this material.

    
    
    
    
14. Steven Huffstutler

    

    11 posts
    
    6/18/2015 1:06 PM

    This stuff is made in China?

    
    
    
    
15. Charles Lafferty

    

    0 posts
    
    6/18/2015 1:06 PM

    Yes sir, watch out for nay products that deal with living things coming out of china, like pets, children or turfgrass.

    
    
    
    
16. Larry Allan

    

    0 posts
    
    6/18/2015 3:06 PM

    sulfometuron methyl....look it up. It kills just about everything in the right dose and has a soil residual to prevent regrowth.

    
    
    
    
17. Charles Lafferty

    

    0 posts
    
    6/19/2015 5:06 AM

    Larry, I know, just about worst case scenario, nasty stuff and symptoms we experienced mirror the label as well. Doesn't kill right away but trans locates into plant and kills when warmer temperatures begin. cold weather holds off products effectiveness, until it gets warm. Crazy stuff!!!

    
    
    
    
18. Steven Huffstutler

    

    11 posts
    
    6/19/2015 5:06 AM

    It's probably past time to check on what products we are using that's produced in China. I try not to buy anything from China, but it's very difficult since we don't make anything here anymore.
    
    Steve

    
    
    
    
19. Timothy Walker

    

    0 posts
    
    6/20/2015 6:06 PM

    United phosphorous and united turf alliance

    
    
    
    
20. Andy Jorgensen

    

    1 posts
    
    6/21/2015 3:06 PM

    Steven Huffstutler, CGCS said: It's probably past time to check on what products we are using that's produced in China. I try not to buy anything from China, but it's very difficult since we don't make anything here anymore.
    
    Steve

    
    
    Almost every chemical in this business is produced overseas, regardless of manufacturer.

    
    
    
    
21. Larry Allan

    

    0 posts
    
    6/26/2015 4:06 AM

    Are they recovering or getting worse?

    
    
    
    
22. David Gresham

    

    0 posts
    
    6/29/2015 9:06 AM

    Sorry guys, haven't been on here in a bit. My greens seem to have ran the gauntlet. I am experiencing some regrowth in my 5/8 spring aerification holes. But, I have opened them up with 1/4 inch cores and 1/4 inch needle tines twice along with the air2g2 machine. Also am spraying every 7-10 days instead of 14. Not out of the woods but seem to be somewhat stabilized. Should receive my herbicide soil test today or tomorrow. Will post what we find. Like Chip said I hope the fact that they admit the contamination means they are excepting blame for this unfortunate situation.

    
    
    
    
23. Larry Allan

    

    0 posts
    
    9/25/2015 7:09 AM

    Hey, so what was the eventual outcome with those greens?

    
    
    
    
24. Charles Lafferty

    

    0 posts
    
    9/28/2015 1:09 PM

    We reopened all greens on labor day weekend. Went from dirt to 12' on the stimp for club championship this past weekend so all is pretty much back to normal. The only problem is the ball marks due to the lack of thatch and mat in the newly established turf, but I am sure that will too rectify itself in time, reluctant to over fertilize and end up with a grow in layer, so I will exercise patience and hope for the best. Looks like we are closing in on an insurance settlement with the company and I have to say they have been very good thru this whole thing, but only time and money will tell that tale. Thanks for the interest and hopefully soon once everyone is made whole, we can write an article about this whole incident to better inform people and educate everyone about the process. Chip