Forum Groups

 

Forums / Talking Turf / New Bunkers

New Bunkers

8 posts
  1. Tommy Witt
    Tommy Witt avatar
    5 posts
    8/16/2017 12:08 PM
    I am considering installing either Better Billy Bunker or Capillary Concrete bunkers with a pro angle or best Signature sand. We have significant erosion issues with our current bunkers and I want to address that. We use effluent water that is really a greenish color. I would appreciate any comments from those of you who already have one of the new bunker technologies and how you have observed your ongoing bunker maintenance and costs. Thanks in advance for your comments.



  2. Michael Wagner
    Michael Wagner avatar
    0 posts
    8/17/2017 11:08 AM
    I have installed and had installed a number of different types of bunkers, I've used Klingstone, Better Billy Bunkers, sod bottom bunkers, different erosion resistant liners and even just compacted clay all with good drainage. In my opinion the best of the best bunkers I've seen and maintained all have 3 things. Sod bottoms, if done correctly are the best liner, there must be adequate drainage, but above all else the shaping outside the bunker to keep water from running off into the bunker is the most important factor. As far as sand goes I like Signature sand. It holds on flashed bunkers the best in my opinion. A lot of bunkers I see have all of these things except the contouring outside the bunker itself is not correct and causes big headaches anytime there is a significant rain storm. That being said I have never tried capillary concrete. Seems like it would be good.



  3. Andy Jorgensen
    Andy Jorgensen avatar
    1 posts
    8/17/2017 11:08 AM
    I have never managed any of them, but have seen them installed. My personal preference would be Capillary Concrete, and only because it is a monolithic system and not a sprayed on adhesive.



  4. Christopher Thuer
    Christopher Thuer avatar
    101 posts
    8/17/2017 2:08 PM
    At the Midwest Regional Turf Foundation conference in 2016 there was a several hour panel presentation of the different methods. Dan Grogan at The Sagamore Club in Noblesville, IN has been installing capillary concrete and loves it. Kyle Callahan at Victoria National in Newburgh, IN has been installing the Matrix system, porous asphalt, with success. John Thompson at Sycamore Hills in Fort Wayne, IN has installed the Better Billy Bunker and it has done him well. I bet they would be good guys to talk with.

    One question I have is in northern areas, how will they hold up with multiple freeze thaw cycles every winter? I would think the pore spaces would hold water until they reach capacity and that water will freeze and busting up the drainage layer just like our wonderful roads. Another is how much fun will it be rebuilding them in the future? I have also heard of some bunkers with the newer methods creating a perched water table and eventually growing algae.

    We have been redoing ours a few every season over the last 14 years and have completed about 35 so far. We put nothing on the bottom but we have been lowering the sod and eliminating the splashed sand faces. We have also tried to make the bottoms as flat as we can. This has greatly reduced the washouts, contamination, and associated labor after hard rain events. We expanded the minimal drainage in each bunker with multiple laterals similar the USGA greens drainage. Our Facebook page shows several. Bear Slide Golf Club Grounds Maintenance.

    Over my 37 years in the biz I have rebuilt a few hundred bunkers and have yet to use a liner or anything else. I simply haven't had the financial resources to do so. As mentioned above the most important factor is reducing the amount of water entering the bunkers from the surrounding area.

    Chris Thuer, CGCS, Bear Slide Golf Club, Cicero, IN

  5. Dennis Ingram
    Dennis Ingram avatar
    5 posts
    8/18/2017 5:08 AM
    Tommy, good morning. BBB by far the best around the world hands down. I am seeing it used under all conditions, all water types, sand types and all environments. I have seen it a few hours after hurricane Sandy in NJ/NYC with no issues. Seeing a lot of BBB in Asia where rainfall amounts are staggering with no issues.



  6. Tommy Witt
    Tommy Witt avatar
    5 posts
    8/22/2017 7:08 PM
    Thanks to all for the info and advise. Appreciate it Regards



  7. Christopher Senior
    Christopher Senior avatar
    0 posts
    8/28/2017 8:08 AM
    Will keep an eye on this thread, we are having the BBB system installed in our bunkers as the course goes through a renovation but other than glowing praise (about both capillary & BBB) that I have heard from friends and peers, I havent been able to work with them yet.

    The one tip I have had from several supes is to start working them as soon as they are installed\, regardless of which system you choose. Never give algae a chance to gain a foothold.



  8. Jeffrey Smelser
    Jeffrey Smelser avatar
    2 posts
    8/31/2017 9:08 AM
    Tommy

    Check with guys in Houston in the upcoming weeks. Jim Brown at Sugar Creek (27 holes) said his Billy Bunkers (9 holes) had wash after 50" of rain (imagine that) but far less than his other 18 holes that used other liners.

    Haven"t heard from guys with Bunker Solutions yet. Brae Burn, River Oaks, Black Horse - Billy Bunkers (ALL CCA Courses) - don't know of any capillary concrete bunkers -some of these course are completely under water and some are only partial under water.

    We received approximately 30" of rain on the island along with very high tides across the golf course but we don't have any liners and our bunkers are destroyed.
    I don't think bunker solutions if feasible for us but maybe Billy Bunkers would be. We don't have contamination issues since we are sand on sand and no steep faces. Our issue is drainage gravel rising through the sand after large rain events.



View or change your forums profile here.