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1. Grall Austin D

   
   5/4/2015 6:05 PM

   I as an assistant hearing what some of you superintendents have said, I think a 55-70 hour work week is fair for assistants because everyone has done it and I don't want to say pay your dues, but an assistant should make your life as a superindrnt less hours and start the family time. It is the job

   
   
   
   
2. Wahlin Scott B

   
   5/5/2015 5:05 AM

   Austin D Grall said: I as an assistant hearing what some of you superintendents have said, I think a 55-70 hour work week is fair for assistants because everyone has done it and I don't want to say pay your dues, but an assistant should make your life as a superindrnt less hours and start the family time. It is the job

   
   
   Anything over 45 hours is not fair. Even at 45 hours you should be compensated for doctor's appointments and school activities with the kids. I never just went out and "played golf". When you take a job like this, that is work. This job has gotten to be ridiculous and it is up to the young people to reign it in. It is up to the GCSAA to reign it in as well. I am retired and I am out, but I just don't see how the young folks are going to make it. You could grow old doing this job before. Not any more.

   
   
   
   
3. Canedo Alberto J

   
   5/5/2015 11:05 AM

   As an Assistant, I worked 44 hours a week on salary. There was times I had to put in extra time, but got compensated by half days off or days off as needed. There is no need to put over 40 hours a week, unless there is an emergency on the golf course. At my current golf course, I work Monday thru Friday 8 hours a day and there is always tomorrow to get the job done. Life is too short, enjoy life as working too many hours can cause problems with family life.

   
   
   
   
4. Keith Lamb

   

   3 posts
   
   5/5/2015 2:05 PM

   My assistant works 40-42 hours a week...tops. In the winter no more than 40. He is first one in to open up and leaves at 2 pm most days. He works one weekend day every other weekend. I fill in the other weekend spots with my foreman, equipment manager and myself. I hated working the 12 on 2 off. I have always scheduled it so nobody has to do this. I work 45-50 hours a week. A Superintendent working his assistant 70 hours a week should be ashamed of himself. I wonder how many hours he works per week? If this assistant is relegated to being a laborer, not supervising employees as a majority of his time working and is being paid salary......he has a pretty strong labor case against his employer.
   
   First and foremost, be happy at what you are doing. When that ends it is time to move on.

   
   
   
   
5. Keith Pegg

   

   0 posts
   
   5/5/2015 5:05 PM

   Scott Wahlin, CGCS said:

   Austin D Grall said: I as an assistant hearing what some of you superintendents have said, I think a 55-70 hour work week is fair for assistants because everyone has done it and I don't want to say pay your dues, but an assistant should make your life as a superindrnt less hours and start the family time. It is the job

   
   
   Anything over 45 hours is not fair. Even at 45 hours you should be compensated for doctor's appointments and school activities with the kids. I never just went out and "played golf". When you take a job like this, that is work. This job has gotten to be ridiculous and it is up to the young people to reign it in. It is up to the GCSAA to reign it in as well. I am retired and I am out, but I just don't see how the young folks are going to make it. You could grow old doing this job before. Not any more.

   
   
   Scott,
   I may not agree with you every time on this however I do. anyone that works over 40 to 45 hours a week needs to be paid for it.
   
   Keith
   Zama Golf

   
   
   
   
6. Jason Baker

   

   12 posts
   
   5/8/2015 7:05 AM

   I love this thread.
   
   As an Assistant I worked 80+ hours most weeks during summer, 70 during spring and Fall and 40-60 during winter. That is all I knew. Other Assistants I knew at the time were doing the same. My Superintendent was there with me the whole time so it was not like he was giving me a list and leaving.
   
   When I got My first Superintendent 's Position it was at a club that did not regularly allow me to pay my crew overtime. So It was just me and my Assistant staying late and getting a few more things (very few with just two of us) done. We were working the 70+ hour week. That lasted about 3 weeks before my Assistant, who was much older than me, told me he had never worked that much or that hard in his life, and that he was not going to be able to continue at that pace.
   
   This really kind of opened my eyes as a young Superintendent who knew nothing else but to work a million hours. I took a long look at my management skills and planning ability and re thought the whole scheme. I have only worked a few 60 hour weeks a year since. That has been 13 + years.
   
   And to be honest, I get damn near as much done as I ever have, considering crew size and budget being relative.

   
   
   
   
7. James Smith

   

   112 posts
   
   5/10/2015 8:05 AM

   I was blessed as an assistant in that my superintendent had just become a superintendent and knew that working salary sucked. He put me on hourly as an assistant and told me he would work me as many hours as I was willing as long as the club was willing to pay for it. I put my wife through college using my overtime (and spare drainage jobs on the side).
   
   I did the same thing when I became a superintendent. My shcedule is 12 days on two days off but the first 17 years at my club I only took off 5-6 weekends. now I make sure to get every other weekend off. ITs not my fault that the club cannot afford to pay enough people to care for their course. When I see money being wasted in other departments it makes my decision to not work to death myself or my crew a lot easier. My club cut my department by three workers this year but the golf shop keeps a cart guy on payroll all day long mostly sitting around on his phone or hiding. What motovation do I have to have my crew do extra work that we cannot get done with 3 less people and we cannot afford to pay overtime?
   
   I made my decision recently when I had my crew in front of the club cleaning out the plant beds when it was a rainy day and his cart guy only sat on his cart trying to bullshite with my workers and the pro knew it.
   
   No one should be made to work 70hrs or more a week without compensation! I do not care if you feel it is paying their dues or not. I do believe that every now and then there will be long days a weeks where an assistant will have to work (aerification, overseeding, projects) with the Superintendent to achieve the clubs goals. A Assistant needs to learn that it will be required as a Superintendent as part of the job, so this becomes a lesson they have to learn to excel at the next level. Keeping an Assistant extra hours to do normal maintenance work like cut grass or whatever should not be expected. I expect my Assistant to work every other weekend as overtime and whenever we have major needs like above and thats it, but he gets paid overtime which helps me to justify not working him to death.

   
   
   
   
8. Corey Eastwood

   

   80 posts
   
   5/11/2015 11:05 AM

   After I wised up and felt I had paid my dues myself and assistant went to 11 on and 3 off. Of course that always did not work for me when it got to 105 degrees. Always snuck back in late afternoon on off day to drag a hose.

   
   Corey Eastwood CGCS, Stockton Golf & CC, Retired
   
   
9. Jeremy Hreben

   

   0 posts
   
   5/21/2015 7:05 PM

   I am right in line with you guys. Excessive late hours or overtime is a sign of poor management.
   
   I do have a quetion though: here in the northeast, with push up, bent/poa greens(mostly poa) there is a need to hand water in the morning. Prepping your historical dry areas. Then syringing in the afternoon. Our witching hour at this course is about 4:30. If greens aren't cooled at 4:30 they wilt and go south. How does one schedule yourself and assistant and maybe one other guy to cover all those syringing hours without OT?

   
   
   
   
10. Jeremy Hreben

    

    0 posts
    
    5/21/2015 7:05 PM

    I am right in line with you guys. Excessive late hours or overtime is a sign of poor management.
    
    I do have a quetion though: here in the northeast, with push up, bent/poa greens(mostly poa) there is a need to hand water in the morning. Prepping your historical dry areas. Then syringing in the afternoon. Our witching hour at this course is about 4:30. If greens aren't cooled at 4:30 they wilt and go south. How does one schedule yourself and assistant and maybe one other guy to cover all those syringing hours without OT?

    
    
    
    
11. Andrew Cross

    

    5 posts
    
    5/22/2015 10:05 AM

    Jeremy Hreben said: I am right in line with you guys. Excessive late hours or overtime is a sign of poor management.
    
    I do have a quetion though: here in the northeast, with push up, bent/poa greens(mostly poa) there is a need to hand water in the morning. Prepping your historical dry areas. Then syringing in the afternoon. Our witching hour at this course is about 4:30. If greens aren't cooled at 4:30 they wilt and go south. How does one schedule yourself and assistant and maybe one other guy to cover all those syringing hours without OT?

    
    
    What we have done in the past when really hot forecast (for weekends only) is send guys home early during week and then bring them back in afternoon on either sat or sunday.
    
    Most times myself or the Super will come in and check. I always try to get them first thing in morning with hose, then since we are an extremely busy public facility I will run overheads during the afternoon to keep them in check, no time for hose work.

    
    
    
    
12. Gary Stevens

    

    0 posts
    
    6/19/2015 2:06 PM

    I do not know if you are being paid overtime or not. You should be aware of the Fair Labor Standard Act that regulates individuals on salary and overtime pay. You should be compensated for your work.
    
    I would also suggest talking to your superintendent about how you are feeling. Communication is key in this business and it is a skill that you will need to in the future. If you can not find common ground then find a new course.
    
    Gary Stevens
    The Woods Club
    West Virginia

    
    
    
    
13. John Vuknic

    

    0 posts
    
    6/30/2015 7:06 PM

    I'm sort of sad by all these posts of long hours not required. I was always told never do the math on your salary versus hours worked as an assistant. It will never add up. I've been a superintendent now for a year and I work no less than 60 hrs a week year round. If your boss doesn't treat you right as a person the bail. If he doesn't match your work then bail. But you HAVE TO TAKE THE TIME to train and trust people to help you get the job done, if not you'll fall by the wayside like many in this business have. Good luck and dig deep.